The Rules Revisited: Female Game for Women in Their 30s

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rules for dating in your late 20s

And having no luck with women really gets tiring. The only issue I feel is that because I am attractive I am constantly pursued by men who may just want sex. I'm pretty terrified of being alone right now. Quite a big birthday, I think. What do you make of my brothers reactions'?

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Or are her youthful looks irrelevant and does it really all just come down to her chronological age? Guys don't get written often either so you could try writing a few that seem like good yet realistic matches. I agree with you! However the amount of "serial husbands" is smaller - plenty of second marriages are for life. But overall advice appreciated. Nadrik posted that "Women in their 30s also tend to know what they want.

If you want to have a committed relationship there is no point unless its committed, that means you should act like you're in a relationship, not juggling a variety of men and 'guy friends' on the side.

There is a big culture shift with women wanting 'freedom to be themselves' and also a traditional monogamous relationship on the side. They are just not particularly compatible. Of course I hold men to the same standard, but I just don't see that many men in relationships behaving this way. I completely agree, I'm almost 21 and my last relationship I thought was going to be a very long term one lasted just over a year , but when things got a little tough I fought hard for the relationship to work but she decided to cheat on me.

Maybe I'm thinking this because it's still quite recent but I'm thinking that the culture shift in the modern female is going to contribute to a lot of broken relationships not saying that men don't cause any problems though , which I feel will lead to a lot of these women having a crisis by their late 20's because they don't know why they haven't been able to find someone to settle down with. Just my 2 cents. What would you describe as the specific downfalls of this culture shift in the "modern female"?

I'm genuinely curious, as a girl who's thought the same thing about my generation as opposed to any specific gender. Keep in mind, 'downfall' is a relative perspective. This is only really 'downfall for long term, serious relationships'. I personally like the independent modern women on a personal level, but its just harder to have a relationship. When you're young you spend a lot of time hooking up and going to parties.

This will always have negative impacts on long term relationships as during that period it will be hard to date and if you have a boyfriend the chances of the relationship ending is far higher. These don't really exist and will always negatively impact a relationship. The reality of modern society is endless attention and validation is just a click away, especially for attractive young females. This tends to make them keep their options open and they never want to 'really' settle down.

I just don't think its 'cool' to settle down with a boyfriend anymore, years ago the pressure was obviously to settle and get married, now most young women's friends will want them to do 'party' things with them and encourage them to drop the guy.

Now these are by no means gender specific. The downfall of people as a whole sleeping around a lot and having more partners is I just don't think relationships are that special anymore and there are a lot of social forces trying to end the relationship, not strengthen it. I'm really glad that you mentioned that it's both genders that behave that way, and not just a problem with women. Also I agree with your points, except that "guy friends" part.

Women and men can definitely be friends, for example I have a few guy friends who are in long-term relationships and we are definitely just friends I know them far too well to ever date them, it'd be like dating my own brother And I'm sure they'd say the same for me after years of listening to my random dating problems.

I have no doubt genuine guy friends do exist for sure, I have women who are genuinely my friends, but I think we both know the "guy friends" hang ons that a lot of women don't remove, I'm not sure if guys have similar "women friend" hang ons do they? Well, the only thing I'd really agree with is that there are a lot of social forces trying to end rather than strengthen relationships. I don't think hooking up or partying is any more of a bad thing in terms of the ability or desire to sustain a long term relationship than being single for any other reason; either way you aren't learning relationship skills.

I don't think friends of the opposite sex are inherently a bad thing either, or social media, and I think you must know a lot of 18 year olds if you really think social media makes people want to keep their options open. Ultimately I think the problem is that we have a culture obsessed with instant gratification and with no concept of hard work for long term gains.

I think this is particularly so in the relationship sphere, and certain things that you mention can feed into that - social media can feed into the "grass is always greener" mentality, and it's easier to maintain friendships that border on the inappropriate and help the transition out of long term relationships.

None of that is really a problem with anyone sensible enough to realise social media is a highlight reel rather than a movie, or someone who respects boundaries. Basically I think the problem is we don't like or want to commit to something that is actually hard work, and we're too ready to give up on it when it isn't perfect. There are positive sides to that that manifest themself in other areas i.

I also a feel like you're a little overly negative on women here when the problem is, IMO, more generational. I'm equally negative on men don't get me wrong. The men are often the ones contributing to the problem. Men as a whole have no honor of sense of decency and will just go after anyone at anytime, boyfriend or not. Men strike me as very pathetic in their attempts to hook up at any costs. I don't agree that the things like social media and hookup cultures are only reflected of changing attitudes, but rather they all go hand in hand.

All of those elements combine to create people that are generally like you said, out for instance gratification and have a throw away attitude towards relationships. They are also forces and outside influences that are somewhat contradictory, people still think they want relationships, but they also want all the instance gratification too and it makes relationships more shallow.

I do however still think that 'hookup culture' and 'party culture' is dragging down traditional relationships. When social pressure was towards staying with one partner it was always going to be more stable than social pressure towards effectively having many partners. Social media, while it doesn't change character, does make it very easy to assess options and cheat.

I'm not sure if you are implying that men are more willing to settle down and commit than women nowadays are, personally I've had the opposite experience in my personal life, eg. Our culture is kind of fucked sometimes. Anyway, I'm sure that women do it as well, just pointing out that it's not a gendered issue.

I suspect it's just experiencing it from differing perspectives. I don't want to settle down and commit and I'm a guy, but I was more outlining why I don't. Relationships struggle to work at the best of times now and there is little incentive for either gender to commit long term. The more options and opportunity someone has, the more certain you can be someone's with you because they want to be with you.

I agree, at that point, but it doesn't exactly create stable long term relationships. There is a reason the divorce rate is going up and up. So long relationships the goal just because they last a while? Or are they the goal because someone wants to be with you that long? Honestly the only issue is the shaming and peer pressure I get from women and guys in commited relationships to settle down. I really find it ironic considering I go out more, have more disposable income and am overall generally happier than them.

It's like society hates your emotional freedom and gets angry if you don't admit that you have a problem. I'm a couple years younger than you, but I have the same feeling. I'm pretty lucky to be in that sort of situation, and I'd bet a lot of that freedom would change if I was in a committed relationship, which I wouldn't want, much as sometimes I feel like I would want to be in one. I'm in a career though only 2 years in so I'm very much still new , and while there's a little rockiness with oil prices, we're fairly stable, have a mortgage on a condo, and kind of a group of friends, a bunch of people I talk to online who I meet up with once a year.

Can't say I have many friends in my city though. I'm 26, chronically single mostly by choice. Just moved states, started a new job, shit is going pretty good.

Social life is a little slow outside of people from work, but I'm getting out and meeting people. I'm a contractor and my work is inconsistent. I live in an area where I don't know anyone and I struggle getting out to meet new people and make friends. I dont have health care anymore so I worry about getting hurt and even if I did have health care the deductibles are so high I would still be broke for anything less than a catastrophic event.

I'm not happy in my relationship and I feel locked in right now. Overall I have a good life. I know it's a topic that's been beat to death, but damn. I really take for granted that going to the doctor is never a big deal. Never had a longer relationship. I am now 35 and live my life pretty much as I want to. I have an awesome apartment, I am saving and paying off, getting richer each month, I buy the stuff I want and go where I want. It is pretty awesome. I'd probably get married if I found someone willing to marry me.

I doubt that will happen as I don't meet many females at all. I am not willing to put in that much of an effort, I'm afraid. If I got married, it would be with a prenuptial and to a woman who has her shit together - her own career, goals, hobbies and life.

I'd like a partner that chooses me because she wants to, not because she has to economically. I will never support my spouse if she's capable of work. Things are pretty good. When I was 28, I was a lb, sterotpical neckbeard, FA, all that stuff. Since then, I've lost lbs, gotten into lifting, started dating and all that.

I'm doing the casual relationship thing, see my friends pretty often and have a bit of money and my job is pretty low stress. I don't have a ton of complaints. No good prospects for any of these in the future. I can't seem to get attention from women. I watch too much porn. I intend on spending all of it traveling the world searching for a more satisfying way of life. For the first time in my life I will have a positive income for the year; I'm on track to pay off my credit-card debt from college and in a few more should have my car paid off.

I joined a gym, started lifting, and have been running 20 miles weekly and I'm now in better shape than when I was in HS. All and all, pretty good I guess. It's nice to get to do what I want when I want. Lately I've been cooking a lot, like gourmet like things, I'm loving it. Also picking up a 4th language, and teaching myself pottery. The time and freedom is remarkably awesome.

I think a mistake I've made for the last year, which I am going to turn around now that I'm 27 as of a couple weeks ago, is that with all that freedom I spent a lot of time focusing of myself and my hobbies and I purposefully avoided people in the process so as to not have to compromise in my decisions.

I just got so consumed with myself that I didn't have the time to develop closer relationships which are formed through compromises. I've learned that a healthy social life style is crucial for staying motivated, even if it is just every other week or so. To you I recommend not to do what I did after my relationship which was pretty much avoid any thought of relationships to work on myself. Be open to new experiences, date for fun, not necessarily for sex or being romantic.

Make new best friends in your newly found hobbies and you'll see that life is a lot more than just being with one other person this includes yourself.

Silver lining in all That's really great advice. I definitely plan on staying away from romance for the time being, I just don't really have the capacity but I will remain open if it feels right. My main goals going forward are to develop a healthy productive lifestyle that won't be compromised by anything, and figure out what I want to do with myself career wise. I have a decent job right now. I make books and various print related products.

I'm a creative person and I'm good at problem solving and working with my hands so it fulfills much of that. I'm just not truly passionate about this. I'm just all over the place which is the main reason why I'm choosing to be alone now, to figure myself out. But I digress, your input is quite motivational. Thanks friend and good luck. Since my last relationship fell apart some 5 years ago I've had very little tying me to any specific place so I've been able to move repeatedly for work.

Done a couple of km moves when people offered me better conditions to be elsewhere. Well it's better then expected and once winter finishes things will pick back up because it will be possible to go outside and do things again. I'm also starting to find things I can spend money on that will actually benefit me, like the new car and the house improvements I am planning.

I don't own the house, but it's a very favourable rental agreement. Socially it's more of a mess. The town doesn't attract that many intelligent young females so the choices are either the kind of derros that don't have an option to leave, or someone from one of the high schools or the hospital.

I really should organise that "Blood from a Stone" singles mixer between the hospital and the mine. I'm guessing you live in the Southern Hemisphere?

I was definitely confused for a second, I think it'd be summer even in Alaska Moved to Munich recently, been living in Europe all year thanks to work originally from Montreal. Got my own place, happy I can cook again, working out, losing weight and it seems that the locals love Canadians just as much most other places I've been so far.

The paper work due to moving and all the bureaucracy is annoying, but that's the only thing annoying me. Planning some week end trips to go to Bordeaux or Austria and Switzerland.

I'm also building my social life here, so I'm always busy. Only thing missing is that one special person in my life, but I'm having fun enough not to really care. Wow I have a hard time reading today because for a moment I thought "Canadiens" like the Habs instead of "Canadians" and I was like " Well, during the playoffs I'd wear my Habs jersey and people from even the smallest towns recognized it.

So I guess it also counts, somewhat. I'm 33, financially independent since early 20s, work a job I mostly like with decent benefits, saving toward a good retirement, and have enough left over to pursue my interests in my spare time nights and weekends.

I go to the gym during the week and tend to cycle or do outdoor activities weather permitting on weekends. I could not be happier with my life and hope to maintain this for as long as my body and mind holds out another 30 to 60 years? I have a decent job, it's a bit boring, but the pay is ok for where I live 40 min commute though I bought a house this year and am saving up to buy a second house so I can rent out my current house. I live in a rural college town so it should provide some solid additional income I hope!

I'll finally be getting my bachelor's degree in March and I'll be graduating with no student loans. Unfortunately I've never had a real relationship so that part of life isn't something I've got any experience in and it doesn't seem like it'll change anytime soon. I have no problem getting laid but for whatever reason a relationship is impossible for me to find.

I think I probably come across as boring outside of the bedroom. I've been trying to improve myself by working out more and trying to find hobbies that other people find interesting but haven't found one that I also find interesting enough for me to dive into.

So life could definitely be worse and I'm thankful it's not, but I have some self-improvement to do. The good is that I have lots of free time, disposable income, and vast freedom. The bad is the soul-crushing loneliness and negative self-thoughts that come from being single too long. I'm 32, currently unemployed, had a nice severance package and receiving unemployment benefit from the state, so no money problems. Learning to play the banjo and improving my golf game a lot.

Tonight I have a date with a really cute and nice girl with whom I hooked up last weekend. Going on a month vacation in about two weeks. I can relate, I just came out of a 1,5 year relationsship that I shouldn't have started in the first place.

I knew this, it still messed me up considerably. God, I'm so stupid. Well now I'm dating. I tinder a lot, and have good success with it. Somehow they all want to do it anyways. I'm 28 and I haven't lived a very normal life, but I'm content. I'm in the city I want to be with a job that's at least a step in the right direction, even though on my current pay it will take forever to pay down my debt.

I kind of had a crisis after college. I went to law school and quit after the first year. I just felt poorly suited for the whole field. Worked for a little while after that, but lingering concerns that I wasn't being who I wanted to be in life started to pull me down.

It felt like I had only a short window to be someone different and if I didn't change things, I'd die as a miserable mid-level administrator. I started reading a lot of Bukowski, btw. I quit my job and moved back in with my parents. I had no real goal other than to make my savings last as long as I could and do as little as possible. Depression took a really firm hold and it wasn't helped by some deaths in the family.

Eventually I started on antidepressants and began seeing some great counselors for cheap local psyc grad program. I started figuring out what I really wanted in life and how to get it. I still have a long way to go, but I like my new job and I love this city. It feels like everything else will fall into place. I've neglected to mention relationships. That's a whole other story unto itself, but I don't have much history there.

I had a couple of serious relationships in college and since then I've never really settled down. It seems to be really hard to meet people, but I'm over a lot of my old fears that kept me from expressing interest.

I really want someone in my life, but I just feel so disconnected from the dating scene. I don't really know how to break in. I'm 33 and have never had a relationship, always been a bit of a loner. I have plenty of free time and lots of disposable income. I have good physical and mental health, so I don't really have any worries at the moment.

I've never been interested in having a wife or kids so I'm not too bothered about that side of things, but I am a bit sexually frustrated. To be honest I'm so used to being independent now I'm not sure I'd cope if I ever found myself in a relationship. I think I'd feel a bit too restricted.

I'm disappointed with my workplace and disillusioned with my employer, but unable to jump ship, so I'm stuck in this small town, relatively unhappy. I've been compensating by taking care of myself by strength training three days a week, hiking or getting out when I can, and hanging out with my small cadre of friends here, whom I like a lot. In the past, all she needed to be was hot. My pool of available partners has shrunk considerably, but my happiness has increased. Rules and games get thrown out the window and everyone is better off for it.

Dating "rules" -- like how many times you should see someone before sleeping with them -- were always stupid, but according to these men, such behavior basically falls by the wayside the older you get. By that point in life most people know better what they want and how to go about getting it. Everyone is more independent, which makes it was easier to know if a relationship is right.

Anyone single and dating in his or her thirties has spent much more time in the world as a functional adult than a twenty-something, which means more life experience and a clearer idea of one's goals and values. Nadrik posted that "Women in their 30s also tend to know what they want.

They have their own interests, friends, hobbies, and aren't nearly as likely to just cling to you and rely on you for their own social life.

Along with increased independence comes assertiveness -- and we all know you're more likely to get what you want when you actually ask for it. It says something about the man, more than his income alone. Andrew did a post about intelligence where he mentioned different kinds of power - all of these are relevant. But financial power or success is particularly relevant because it is a sign of intelligence, ambition, dedication, commitment and a masculine mindset.

Any woman who says she doesn't care about it, is either lying, very very young or has few options with men and is trying to convince herself it doesn't matter.

I am 22 and the guys I am looking to date are primarily I'd be open to guys that are , but I will be far more skeptical - in fact, I rarely go on dinner dates with guys in this age range. I've always been fairly attracted to older men, so if I meet a decent and good divorced man who's 45, I would be happy to go on a dinner date.

When I turn 25, I would probably expand the age gap a little. At 22, even though I feel old for my age, I will fear a 45 year old man wants e primarily for my beauty. J - I think you need to realize that although men and women often look for similar values to settle down, they are biologically different and experience different attraction cues.

For men, those are related to beauty and for women, the are related to power. Women possess more of these attraction cues in their 20s, men have more of them after 30 and further down the line. You might be dismissing something men yourself, but the reality is that most women don't. And this blog, like most blogs giving women dating advice, has to base itself on reality, not wishful thinking or exceptions to the rule. At least if women are to gain something from it.

Sometimes men insist on paying for the dates and my persistent refusal would seem rude. I always offer to pay and back off when rejected. I am most comfortable with taking turns, i. However, older men seem to have this big-brother mentality, that they ought to treat you like a younger sister and take care of you and pay for everything.

I dated several guys like that, the bigger the age gap, the less likely he would let me pay. I wasn't digging for gold, I just enjoy the conversation a lot more than with guys my own age or younger.

Anon feb 18, 5: I've noticed this with older men too, and it can be really weird when he treats you like a little sister but you know he wants to boink you at the same time.

I have to admit to being old-fashioned. I do prefer for the man to pay on the first date any more isn't necessary unless it's his thing. I was taught that that is how a gentleman acts and I'm put off by any man who doesn't do that.

So yeah, call me old-fashioned. If a man I date has a different opinion to me then it's obviously a clash of values. I did have a rich boyfriend and was a bit ticked off that he didn't pay for me so much. Wait, let me explain. It's not because I wanted a chunk of his wallet. It's because he'd deliberately avoid making romantic gestures that would incur a cost because he had some complex about all women being golddiggers. Basically, he was hedging his bets. I actually spent more money on him in the relationship despite me being a bit of a poor sod who was too hopelessly besotted.

I don't like keeping score but clearly that arrangement didn't work. I also like the idea of an older guy having dated a wider variety of women and so the chances of him knowing what's important to him in a relationship are higher, " just wanted to add that a man who "dated a wider variety of women" is NOT necessarily more likely to know "what's important to him in a relationship.

Whereas the man who "just knows" that a woman is the one for him without having had to date "a variety of women," just seems like a man who would be more willing to commit and remain faithful. There's also a major advantage of him having less baggage, and the woman he's married to not having to worry about being compared to all the other women he's been previously with.

The stats linked earlier clearly show that most marriages have an age gap of years. Even years ago the average age difference wasn't more than that. Im a 23 year old and while I do find older men attractive its not something I would seek right now, personally.

Id much rather marry a guy years older and look forward to him becoming a silver fox. There is a world of difference between a 20 and 30 year old, but the difference between, say, a 35 and 45 year old are less pronounced. I am somewhat of an "old soul". When one comes up to me I automatically filter them out as being mainly interested in sex or arm candy. Even though most guys years older than me will still be mostly interested in sex I at least know that there is a higher likelihood of them being attracted to me on a personal level, outside of physical attraction.

If the large age gap works for you thats great and I wish you the best of luck. However, given the statistical evidence it isnt common nor is it something most women are into, unless the man in question is exceptional and has an overabundance of a specific characteristic she is attracted to ie power, fame, money, wisdom, dentures: Why not have more confidence that your personality might be appealing to a wider range of men? It sounds like feminist propaganda trying to convince men and women that they can't have enough in common with each other if there's a larger age gap.

How do they know? Maybe the odds are that they won't have as much in common but if both find each other attractive and like each other's personality then go for it. Our personalities are a culmination of our biology, upbringing, and cultural references; the latter two being influence by the generation we grew up with.

Chances are a man who is closer to my age will be more compatible with me in that regard. Thats just a fact. Thats not to say there are no 35 yr olds that would be compatible but generally speaking a 27 yr old would be a better fit. This is not the result feminist bougie women, its a preference women have for men who are slightly older than themselves, exceptions notwithstanding. I certainly don't dispute the average age diff.

I'm not saying young women should get with older men, just that if that younger woman and older man want to and are compatible then more power to them. Human are living longer and longer while taking less care of themselves.

I have no desire to be stuck playing nurse to my husband while I'm still wanting to travel Europe in my retirement. That is a large reason why I cap my upper age limit to about 7 years. Not only that, marriage is more than just about looks and money. It is also finding someone who is my best friend. If you have a generation gap, that is less likely to be the case. Not to mention the "life experience" of someone that much older than me will probably have. I want someone to experience life with me, not watch as I experience it.

And for those seeking much younger mates because they are more attractive? A word of caution if you will - someone who is in their mid to early twenties is still growing and learning about themselves. Who they are now, is not who they will be 10 years from now.

Yes, everyone changes through time, but not nearly as much as in our youth. Personally, if I was a man, I'd take a hot 30 year old over a hot 20 year old.

Just by virtue of being young, the 20 year old looks hot. The 30 year old had to work at it. That ups her chances of not "letting herself go" once she has a ring on her finger. To each her own. If you can find that man your same age that wants to marry and so forth then more power to you. But some women can't and so them it's better to marry an older man and then be single for the last 10 or 15 years of her life than alone her whole life.

Let's assume she lives to 81 http: That means they can have 41 years together and then she will have 15 years alone after he dies. So, that is a real likelihood but you have to compare it to her options. If she loved him more than the other men she could have had then I'd say 41 years together is pretty awesome. As to not being able to be friends or best friends with a man that's 10 years older I just flat-out disagree.

Maybe the odds are smaller but it can still happen. Once the woman is 35, yes, but 30 is still young enough that she'll probably only be very slightly below her peak beauty. For the single white woman in the US, her life expectancy is 81 per the link I provided. For black females, it's But let's use Some, granted, slowly, but once you get to that age, looks quickly stop being about "lucky genes" and start becoming about how much effort your are willing to put into it.

You need to eat right, you need to exercise, you need to not chop off your hair just because you are now a mom and it is "easier", you need to continue to dress nice even if you are so tired you just want to put on sweats, you need to take time to do your beauty regiment even if you need to put food on the table and run that errand!

American women are notorious for letting themselves go after they get married. If you want to remain "hot" you have to work for it and want it , and yes, that means starting as early as your mid-twenties.

I wish someone had told me that! Maybe I wouldn't be single today. I started to really care about my looks at 28, and sadly, I think it is too little too late. I think I did too much damage to my body during that time that no amount of anything will turn me pretty. True story, my hair dresser is Korean and said to me, "When you finally get a boyfriend, come back here and I'll put highlights in your hair. The lady who did my hair was American and I asked her about highlights.

She said, "Yeah, you should get them, it will help you get a boyfriend. And, although I don't disagree with what you are saying about age, I'm not talking about living 10 to 15 years alone because your husband passed on. I'm talking about when they are still alive but are so bad they can't take a shower, dress themselves, or even go to the restroom without help. I see it with my own parent's who are falling apart in their mid's.

I see it with my 80 year old grandma who has to be taken care of like an infant. Maybe it is more an issue of health and how important it is for you to try to live healthy than age, but I rather be single and be able to live for myself than married to someone I have to live for before they can't do it themselves.

If you have never cared for an elderly person, it's hard to understand. So, if you don't want to take care of a man who is old then I guess you'd have to marry a man about 10 years younger than you! If he's 10 years younger then you'll die 5 years before him and he'll have to take care of you! All this just seems like too much thinking. Find someone you're mutually in love with and be happy as long as you can and take care of each other when that time comes.

J, you have good points. I never thought of that Why do you say it's too late for you in the looks department? Not speaking about J but too much tanning, drinking or drugs or other miscare can age a woman and there is little to do once the ageing has set in. I'm going to stop drinking. After drinking at university, I can tell it's aged me even if only a little bit. The tanning is the worst though. Luckily I don't really tan because I live in Scotland but I still go out with sunblock every day without fail in order to block the UVA rays.

I read somewhere that this is far more effective than buying anti-aging creams later on. I agree with you! This is not bragging, just my 2cents, but as a "hot" 26 y.

The thing is, because I have the choice, if I want to get married now i'll look for the guys who are young and fresh.

That's an opinion I share with the majority of my girl friends. And even if older guys appear to be be more mature and stable, they sometimes have others issues that makes them not so desirable bitterness, not so fun Assuming for argument's sake that you are hot then that makes you a small minority of women and yes, you can have your pick of many men though not all.

What advice would you give the average or ugly girl, though? I'm curious, are all your friends as hot or hotter than you? If so, then your advice isn't harmful really since you have so many men to choose from. But what about those who don't have so many.

Don't you think that they would do well to expand their age range to up the number of good guys to choose from? That likely would mean they the average and ugly girls should consider older as well, if they are 26 then a woman should consider a man into his mid 30's but possibly even a year or two younger if he has his act together, though it's likely that the slightly older guy will have his career more in place and be looking to marry.

Even hot girls should probably be willing to think upwards in age. Basically, if keeping a narrow age range works for you and you can easily find a great guy to marry or date then continue. But a lot of women complain that they can't find a good guy, so, expand your age range a bit and see what you find. In the end you don't have to go for the older guy but it probably makes sense to at least consider the possibility.

I am not the poster above but I can answer that. I am 25 graduate student and fairly attractive. I think the age range is a bit narrow, personally for me.

But I don't think there is such a thing as 'ugly girl', though some have better features and genetics than others. Before throwing in the towel to date whomever you can get. You must work on yourself first. At least try to get around your age if you have time In your 30s, I agree with your mentality, even though you should never let yourself go.

Even in marriage, never let yourself go. So maybe you don't like the word 'ugly' but will you at least agree that there are women who men find to be physically attractive, average and unattractive? I think that the important people to ask though is men. Do they believe there are unattractive or ugly women? Obviously, the answer is yes. But such women can find bf's or husbands if they will work on themselves and lower their expectations to more realistic levels.

I had one friend that was on the unattractive side of things who was wanting guys that were on the attractive side in all three areas of career, looks and personality. She was being totally unrealistic. Also, I think your age range of men is reasonable, especially if you're not finding it too hard to find good guys to date.

The reason I had such a response to the word 'ugly' is because most woman are complacent to throw in the towel. Unfortunately, ugly in today's day and age refers to body over features, due to the obesity crisis in America. I have seen plenty of average looking woman, at best, get married over their overweight attractive friends simply because of a little effort. With all the resources out there to make anyone attractive, I have run across very few women that are beyond repair. I work on myself all the time.

And I think it is important for less attractive woman to realize this. No one grows up and maintains 'model status' with little effort. Not that I am 'model status', just presenting an extreme. Granted I have my own issues to deal with, even with enough guys to date. Building your career as a women foremost has its repercussions. I could not hold a relationship with men my age from ages 18 to Men my age would consider seriously dating me until it got difficult with my moving around.

It was easier to date good-looking, easy girls that followed them, idolized their wit, and were present for sex without LDR. It hurt to break up like that, especially when these men would break all contact yet follow you on social networking for whatever reason, impeding moving on.

I agree that if a lot of the young overweight women would lose some weight that their underlying features are anywhere from average to attractive and certainly better than when being hid by 10, 20, 50 or more lbs of extra weight.

And, no, women, please don't go to unhealthy extremes in trying to lose weight. Men don't prefer anorexic looking girls over more normal-but-not-fat looking girls. However, they might prefer the really skinny girl over the fat girl. Hope you're in a more stable situation now so you can have a good relationship and even marriage with the right guy.

It sounds like you might be. Girls generally take being "hit on" as validation. Us guys hit on a lot of girls. The gap between girls that I'll hit on vs girls that I'll commit to is massive. If that makes you feel better about yourself, you're like the guy that jumps at and does tricks for any sort of female attention.

Be better than that. I'm overweight myself and have been for a while although I recently lost 20lbs. I still have another 20lbs to lose to look my best. After I read something in this blog about waiting to see which men are attracted to me, I decided that it was worth investing the hard work to put myself in a better position. Then there is the obvious translation into feeling great about yourself. It makes me slightly queasy sometimes when a man is hitting on me because I can't work out how real it is.

I dislike it if a man calls me "beautiful" or "gorgeous" but I still accept the compliment graciously. I have to say that I completely agree with you about not jumping at any guy who gives you attention. That is not something I do in spite of how I occasionally feel otherwise.

And I believe that some men can sense if you're the type of woman who would jump at any attention, and use that to their advantage. I think your comment was very apt. Part of why some women say a lot of stuff like that is because of oneupmanship over who is the hottest. I know it sounds silly but it happens. Sometimes other women have tried to jeopardize my chances with certain men by telling me "oh he's not really into you. He's only being friendly".

And on occasion I've had some women tell me I'm not as hot as them because they've slept with more men than me. If I'm not interested in shagging someone for the sake of it, some tell me I'm frigid. This stuff hasn't stopped even though I'm almost in my mid-twenties. I still don't understand why some women choose to run each other down. We are all beautiful in our own way.

Lucy, some men will exaggerate their compliments to try and get in a woman's pants. So, watch what men do, not what they say. However, excessive compliments seems more like a chump move and so those guys probably aren't getting laid a lot unless they have a lot of charm and other attractive stuff going for them. As to number of sex partners having anything to do with the female's attractiveness, no.

Men looking for casual are willing to sleep down in "quality" so a woman can basically rack up as high a number as she wants. It seems like projection of those women's thoughts about how only really attractive or charismatic or famous men can sleep with 's of beautiful women. And N is an incomplete piece of data, you need to know how hot the women were. What does tell you about how attractive a woman is overall not just looks is who wants to have a relationship with her.

And regarding her looks, get a representative sample of men with no ulterior motives to rate the looks and then you'll know.

Men can tell pretty quickly if a woman is a 5 or a 7 or a 9 in looks to him. Thanks for your response, HanSolo. Just to clarify that I'm definitely aware of that but I think it's a lot less bother to say 'thank you' than to start outwardly scrutinising a comment. I generally don't like compliments like that because they feel very insincere and I don't want to be put on a pedestal or objecified. Most of the guys who hit on me seem to be like that. It's actually quite hard to find a normal healthy guy with no baggage let alone someone I have a connection with and who is on a level with me I mean in terms of how they talk to me and not about looks or anything like that.

And I can't answer that for myself yet as I'm in a situation where I'm meeting hardly any men. So there you go. I'd rather focus on my overall quality as a person than get tied down worrying about what I look like. Lucy I am about to totally launch into guy trying to solve your problem mode!!!! Not sure where you are but have you tried online dating? On POF, there are x as many men as women you can actually search and see how many are returned in the area you're looking at and so even though there will be a lot of incompatible men there are likely to be a few that would be great guys.

Guys don't get written often either so you could try writing a few that seem like good yet realistic matches. As in other situations, don't go for someone way out of your league or they'll likely just want casual sex if anything. And what's the worst that could happen?

Likely they just don't respond and look on the bright side! I think focusing on your overall quality as a person is good Yes, men and women can get too superficial about looks sometimes but there is also a good reason that men and to a lesser degree, women care about looks and height and teeth and such. Fertility, healthiness, and strength were things that allowed our ancestors to survive and reproduce and we have inherited being attracted to many of those things.

Anyway, I assume that you might be meaning that you don't just focus solely on your looks and if so then I think that's great. However, I would highly recommend giving some attention to your looks unless they're already maximized since even raising your looks by 0.

CastleFebruary 18, at 4: Where is the love? This seems like an instruction booklet to breeding. I would rather be single than settle for someone who wasn't my best friend and lover. I value friendship more now than I did in my 20's. Do you guys consider love at all? Does your attractiveness for a woman increase the more you like her personality? It works that way for me. You can be a stud but if you're dumb, take a hike. Does being a '10' trump intelligence every time?

I wonder because I hear a lot of guys say, bitches be crazy! Will you put up with the crazy as long as she's hot? Kendra, welcome to the difference in male and female attraction triggers. Looks are more important to men than to women. But women are attracted to charismatic, successful, and famous men.

It is what it is and it's best to accept reality and make the best of our lot in life instead of wanting to change everything around us--a nearly impossible task. I'm in my late 20's and consider myself to be mature, however, because I've often been told that I look younger than my age, when I have been approached by older men, who I know are attracted to me and like the fact that I'm younger than them I don't always feel like I'm taken as seriously or shown as much respect by them, in spite of the fact that I'm intelligent and mature.

Although I would prefer a man who is only years older than myself, I would be open to dating someone years older. However, I do have some questions. The first being, do older men really view women years younger than them as equal partners worthy of their respect, or just silly young bimbos? I frequently hear about mens' preference for younger women, but even if they manage to get one, they'll sometimes complain about her lack of maturity and treat her like she doesn't know anything, even that's not true.

Another question I have is, are some older men who pursue women years younger just looking to re-live some of their youth? Lastly, how do you filter between the men who are still single in mid's because they haven't found the right woman, as opposed to those who might just be immature, players, or potential confirmed bachelors?

I view younger women as potentially equal partners. But that depends on the content of their character. If they are intelligent, mature, kind and intellectually curious then I will grant them the respect they are due.

So, I think a lot of guys do want to respect the woman they're with and if you give them a chance to get to know you they will find that you are intelligent and mature. You just have to filter out the ones that aren't looking for that. Some men may be looking to relive their youth a bit but as long as they treat you well and are looking for long-term assuming you want that then what's wrong with them feeling pleased with being with a younger looking woman such as yourself.

There could be issues later on if he is an extreme case but if he's treating you great and wants to commit then I wouldn't worry about it too much. How do you filter? As Andrew said above you can bring up related topics after a date or three such as what he thinks about his nephews or what he thinks about what's wrong or right with relationships these days.

I wouldn't come right out at the start and say, "Are you looking to get married in 1 year and be faithful forever and have kids? And finally, look at how he treats you. If he's being really aloof and just into it for the sex then you have your answer. If the conversations are great and he's respectful and that can be in addition to great sex too and introduces you to his friends and family eventually and wants to do lots of stuff with you and make you his gf then you likely know he's looking for long-term commitment.

I don't think it's that hard. Just use some common sense and get a couple trusted guy friends that aren't secretly in love with you so that they sabotage you with their advice or a brother that you can get the male perspective from on the guy's actions. I like my half brothers best friend, he's got a personality type that I like and seem to just click with, maybe I'm imagining it I don't know, I really only meet a guy I feel that kind of drawn to once every few years though so I feel its worth getting a second opinion.

He's also friendly with my other brother, we all socialise together sometimes but we have our own friends too. Few obstacles though, namely that he has a girlfriend, and he's also nearly a year younger I normally only ever like guys a good few years older. And we drunkenly slept together a little while ago after I went on a night out with my half brother and his friends, they fell asleep and he sat up chatting and having a drink, the rest is kind of a blur.

I'm aware potentially moving in on someone else's boyfriend is not reeally a nice thing to do, but you know we're both young, boyfriends and girlfriends do come and go. Anyway after that happened I just thought well I've fucked it now anyway so just forget about it, we were in touch for a little bit afterward but then the other brother found out and kicked off, I went back to the city I study in, and I've not had much opportunity to spend time with him since, but when I have as I said I just thought I'd destroyed any potential for anything anyway so I've just been generally friendly but not gone out of my way the odd time I have seen him.

I've spent a bit of time with my half brother recently and he brought it up in context of something else I can't remember what now so I had the opportunity to quiz him a little bit, he seems to think that his mate likes me, he said his mate has said I'm a laugh, that if he split up with his girlfriend he'd want to be with me, a few things to that effect.

My brother's response is always shut up you've got no chance,but they're quite banter-y lads anyway. I was also expecting about ten years of "That's not what your sister said! I got the impression my half brother wouldn't have minded if me and him got together properly , but I'm wondering if he might be filtering what his friend has said through his own opinion i. He also seems to think the relationship is on the rocks, but I know he doesn't personally find the girlfriend attractive so obviously he's not going to see what his friend sees in her.

If nothing else I'm just happy that he doesn't think badly of me now and that we can all still be friendly. Just for additional info he wasn't weird at all with me in the morning, chatty as ever, brought me a cuppa grabbed the seat next to me in the car etc.

But as I said we kept in touch for a bit but no huge effort made to spend time with me, last time I heard from him was a random text on my birthday. The other brother was disappointed in me and I think upset that his friend crossed the line though they're not nearly as good friends. He also has a close friend of his own that we've known since childhood that I think he would quite like to see me end up with. Any other time I've been around that guy both brothers have been there, and I don't know about him but I've felt conscious of it.

Did you sleep with him before or after he had the girlfriend? Regardless, I'd wait until he's single before pursuing him if you decide to pursue him at all.

As they say and there's some truth to it , the way you get someone is the way you lose him, so if you take him away from his gf then that means he's the type of guy that can be taken away from a girl and might sleep with another girl while drinking.

If you were both drunk and slept together while he had a gf then I'll give you a half pass because you were drunk but not a full one. If he did have a gf I think you should also look to make some changes in you as well. Not trying to be a harsh dick but if you want a really happy and faithful relationship with someone you have to act that way from now on and not go after other women's men.

Please clarify if he had a gf when you slept with him because because I think that is a huge sign as to whether either of you is really ready and fit for a serious faithful relationship. That said, if you two really are compatible then you can go out with him when and if he's single again and see but I wouldn't try to steal him away from her.

Also, I would continue your life and meet guys in the meantime and not just wait for him forever. Thanks for replying 'twas a bit of a yarn, especially as I'm asking advice on something maybe I shouldn't be doing No he was with his girlfriend at the time, I have virtually no recollection of it happening to be honest I don't drink like that often either it's just my brothers and their friends tend to constantly buy me drinks when we go out and that night I got too drunk.

I don't go after other women's men, it's not something I've ever done before as it goes, but the older I get the more I see things less black and white, it might be that we are more compatible or maybe not the way I see it if there is someone else you like better then you're free to leave. I always followed these strict rules actually and to be honest it's not helped me meeting anyone I'm compatible with, and I see most people bending them.

So I have sort of changed my outlook, but starting from not going after another woman's man ever I wasn't looking to really throw myself at him now anyway, just engineer some situations I could spend a bit of platonic time with him, get to know him a bit better and then presumably if he thought I was worth it he'd leave of his own accord to maybe in some circumstances it's ok. My bigger concern is whether he is ready for a relationship - not that I'm completely unconcerned about his having a girlfriend but I've never met her or heard much about her so she doesn't really seem real to me, plus I don't really believe you can steal someone, I reckon they'd stay if they wanted to stay - but as I said he's a bit younger than me, been in a relationship for a while, I'd be more concerned about maybe not being ready for a or another relationship.

I've been out on a few dates and stuff since, I'm clearly the common denominator here ha ha but I meet a guy where there's that mutual attraction about once every four years literally, if that explains why I'm making a big deal over this one despite the potential drama, and why in this case I'm not wanting to put some random girls needs above my own harsh as may be, but I'm sure as hell another girls never done that for me before.

The other stuff would be more of a concern really. What do you make of my brothers reactions'? Well, meet up in groups with him and avoid drinking too much. I wouldn't pursue him though. Use the group hang-out time to see if you even really think he's relationship material or not. Don't try and sabotage his gf though.

If he doesn't like her enough he'll break up. If he likes you more and her not enough then eventually he'll break up with her and make a move.

The age thing doesn't matter so much though younger men are less likely to want a relationship So, take it casual and let things happen and figure out in a more calm way if you really like him.

Probably will be more useful for you though to forget about him and find someone else that is single and really examine why you find you have a connection with so few men. Maybe you're really picky or are hard to get along with! But, I'd really look inside you and figure out why you're not feeling a connection more often.

Are you really picky and very rarely is anyone good enough for you? Think of the kind of man you want and are you what he would want? I'm not saying you're not. Just some food for thought with very little info about your looks or personality to say anything better. Yeah I agree, it's not lazyness but I don't want to pursue, I just think I'd initially have to engineer some group situations myself and then be able to gage my interest if its worth all the potential drama and his. I've thought about this myself before, I'm going to go easy on myself and say it's not a case of me or anyone else not being good enough, more a case of just not coming into contact with the right personality types.

For instance the men I've liked in the past have been at least 5 years older, they've tended to have practical kind of jobs, and kind of a laid back attitude, more rebellious in the past and kind of a hedonistic streak. I'm actually doing a difficult degree that I realised was not for me about a year in but I've stuck it out for the full four because I wanted to get the qualification.

As a result I've made less close friends on the course than I have at High school, college, jobs people on other courses etc although still quite a few , quite a few of the ones I most clicked with have dropped out or changed courses, I generally get on with most of the people but just in comparison to how many people are on it there's not many where I'd say we really click.

It's also about 70 per cent women. To be honest a lot of them come across as overly competitive and anal to me, although I don't find a bit of competitiveness as off putting in men as I do in other women. So I don't think I'm coming into contact with that many people that would be right for me on a daily basis, I'm laid back myself, I am a bit hedonistic although I'm not a waster - I am doing a difficult degree and I have managed to stick it out for four years and get good grades even though I hate it.

I was pretty rebellious as a teenager as were most of my close friends - even the ones I met after, I think most university educated people, or at least the ones on the difficult courses, have very much stuck to the path that's expected of them all the way along. It's a good trait but I don't really understand them,and some of those types might think they like me at first but in the end I don't think I'd be what they'd be looking for either. Both of my brothers fit this personality type which is why we get on, although the half brother has cheated on every girlfriend he's ever had so far which is a bit ominous.

I know those personality types comes with their flaws but I'm that way out and I've never had a problem being faithful - although I'm a woman so maybe it's different longest relationship was 4 years.

I'm really wanting to know if anything can be gained from my brothers reactions though, especially as they know us both and have been completely opposite? HanSoloFebruary 18, at 2: What exactly does it mean for a woman to look young for her age? Does Jennifer Aniston look young for her age? I'd appreciate an example, if possible.

It seems to me that "you look young for your age" is becoming a safe way to compliment someone. I get that a lot even though I don't think I look young for my age. Some of my colleagues are in their late 40s and early 50s, they take good care of themselves so they don't look old, but they still look their age.

I think the same thing when American women say "I still get carded.

Images: rules for dating in your late 20s

rules for dating in your late 20s

No one held your attention enough to keep you going?

rules for dating in your late 20s

They will use the something man for sex and his wallet, but if she wants to get married and is good looking and she will be if somethings are after her she has plenty of options in the something range to marry. Worked for a little while after that, but lingering concerns that I wasn't being who I wanted to be in life started to pull me down.

rules for dating in your late 20s

I'm talking about when they are still alive but are so bad they can't take a shower, dress themselves, or even go to the restroom without help. I am 30 and just today a rules for dating in your late 20s freaked out because Black south african dating told him I've been living in LA for 7 years now. Do not make posts asking about a specific person's or group of people's actions, behavior, or thinking. I won't be able to tell if two women are three years apart, if they both look their age. I wonder because I hear a lot of guys say, bitches be crazy!